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This is actually not as difficult as it sounds. Using even the current format as it's not the documentation format that is the problem but the interface into it.<BR/><BR/>Just an example of how document contributions can be made.<BR/><BR/>1. John is struggling to install a new application. He does not know how. So he clicks on "Help and support" <BR/><BR/>2. He finds how to add an application and starts installing. <BR/><BR/>3. But he notices a spelling error or a miscommunication in the help documentation. So he goes into the page right clicks goes into edit mode and submits he's suggestion. <BR/><BR/>4. The documentation maintainer receives the suggestion and accepts it. Sally opens up the help page (after updating of course) and there is no spelling or logic errors in the documentation.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19783718.post-11784977956113796512008-09-03T02:53:00.000+12:002008-09-03T02:53:00.000+12:00Hi, John!I basically agree GNOME's sites are in a ...Hi, John!<BR/><BR/>I basically agree GNOME's sites are in a sad state.<BR/><BR/>To give you another example: I learned today that GNOME files was hacked and Eugina has no intention to re-animate the site.<BR/><BR/>This is unfortunate: Is there a better way to "sell" the basic desktop other than letting people them find out what great applications exists for it? It's a necessary marketing tool.<BR/><BR/>But now it's gone. That's the problem if GNOME lets third-party manage major marketing tools.<BR/><BR/>Concerning the critical comments: Many of the pages linked by the central GNOME site are not in SVN. GNOME files is one example but there are others.<BR/><BR/>For some of these sites, it's just not easy to change something.<BR/><BR/>In fact, there was a long discussion (over the last five years or so) on the GNOME web and marketing lists to update the central site to a CMS so that more people can contribute (without having to check out SVN and hack HTML files manually).<BR/><BR/>This is a site where changes would be possible. <BR/><BR/>But it seems it lead nowhere: Just last week, Stormy Peters opened a Google Docs account to improve and layout a new Friends of GNOME page. If the CMS would work, why is there a need to use Google Docs for collaboration?<BR/><BR/>Contributing to the GNOME web is not just a matter of having SVN access; it's also needs help from the sys admins and the web team.<BR/><BR/>An additional problem is control: Some GNOME contributors seem to over-emphasizes the meaning and influence of words and, thus, they want control.<BR/><BR/>I can't recall how many times I've seen Havoc Pennington complain on Planet GNOME about the GNOME short description on the front page. Since I wrote it, this is of course disappointing. He could have changed it but he didn't. So much for making improvements instead of complaining.<BR/><BR/>However, this example teaches something about the problem of control: With so many people contributing to GNOME, everybody has a different idea what it's all about and how it should be presented. But hardly anybody is willing and capable to produce a solution to the problem. I believe, there's none; very much like there's not one interface design that satisfies the needs of all users.<BR/><BR/>As a result, the GNOME's website(s) look so much like a patchwork. Maybe, other activities -- such as the friends of GNOME campaign -- suffer from these issues as well.<BR/><BR/>The core problem is that many existing contributors don't want to leave their comfort zone. I wouldn't say they don't care. They just didn't became used to any other way of working with users and marketing their software. It's a matter of habit, not motivation.<BR/><BR/><BR/>Cheers, <BR/>ClausAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19783718.post-62765500136680569312008-09-02T01:22:00.000+12:002008-09-02T01:22:00.000+12:00As a user I'm grateful to see post like this. Cri...As a user I'm grateful to see post like this. Criticism should be welcomed, not taken as a personal affront.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19783718.post-26696892006570730252008-09-01T03:22:00.000+12:002008-09-01T03:22:00.000+12:00As said before, shouldn't we use library.gnome.org...As said before, shouldn't we use library.gnome.org instead of developer.gnome.org ? Are they still important docs on developer.gnome.org ?<BR/><BR/>Maybe we should open a thread on the corresponding ml (infrastructure or marketing maybe) to talk about that (with a blogpost on the planet to recruit volunteers). It's a more appropriated place to have the opinion of gnome-people.<BR/>I don't know anything about html/whatever but I'm willing to help.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19783718.post-48400200115663236832008-09-01T03:20:00.000+12:002008-09-01T03:20:00.000+12:00Interesting ideas for docs, but it will be pain in...Interesting ideas for docs, but it will be pain in the ass for worlwide translations.<BR/><BR/>Reducing memory footprint, speed, polishing etc. is not for GNOME 3.0, but for GNOME 2.xx. If we plan a GNOME 3.0, we need to come with new ideas, not just improvements. See KDE, they revamp a lot of things, with pain, but they do it.<BR/><BR/>So we need ideas and developer taskforce. Personnaly I have a lot of (IMHO) interesting ideas for GNOME (e.g. something about using empathy as a framework for collaborative work and communication using your contact list, hildonization of most of GNOME) but I'm not a developer. And developers are very busy and rare people.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19783718.post-5139814613181108482008-09-01T02:13:00.000+12:002008-09-01T02:13:00.000+12:00Also, if you would have done your homework, you wo...Also, if you would have done your homework, you would have noticed gnomesupport.org was registered to Luke Stroven. The name doesn't immediately ring a bell here, but apparently he also owns gnomedesktop.org.<BR/><BR/>Anyway, point in case: why on earth do you expect the gnome community to keep sites which are not even under our control consistent? Sounds to me like you noticed something, and decided to go on a random whine against it without doing your homework properly.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19783718.post-88201017072326117772008-09-01T01:03:00.000+12:002008-09-01T01:03:00.000+12:00Why do you say that the developer documentation is...Why do you say that the developer documentation is out of date. developer.gnome.org is clearly not ideal, as it now mostly consists of just links to library.gnome.org, and a few archived documents. But those first few links are not to out-of-date stuff:<BR/>http://developer.gnome.org/<BR/><BR/><BR/>Or am I misunderstanding you? Specifics would be helpful. Then we can fix whatever it is that is bothering you.<BR/><BR/><BR/>However, we should indeed think about replacing any links to developer.gnome.org with links to library.gnome.org, if we don't find a good use for it,<BR/><BR/><BR/>MurrayAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19783718.post-84141302190745245722008-08-31T22:58:00.000+12:002008-08-31T22:58:00.000+12:00I said it as:1) You're on Planet GNOME. Don't pret...I said it as:<BR/>1) You're on Planet GNOME. Don't pretend you're still an outsider / user. If you consider that is the case, please ask Jeff to remove you from Planet GNOME (it is for GNOME hackers and contributors, always said that).<BR/>2) You are on marketing-list (you should be at least as you talked about marketing). Where www.gnome.org was discussed quite recently. It is pretty low to make this post and ignore the info from marketing-list or all the stuff you can find on live.gnome.org.<BR/>3) I'm far from flaming. Your the one who is accusing. 'We do not care and stuff'. If you do not see how bad it is to write that, don't say I was flaming you (I replied *because* of the way you said things).<BR/><BR/>Oh and regarding the anonymous stuff: I'm bkor and I don't like blogger.com.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19783718.post-29326315859232093592008-08-31T19:58:00.000+12:002008-08-31T19:58:00.000+12:00Considering the standard answer is "Do it yourself...Considering the standard answer is "Do it yourself"<BR/><BR/>The front page www.gnome.org has a small tab 'Contribute' (I would prefer, "I want to help!"). The single word is just dull and actionless.<BR/><BR/>Anyway, the page goes to the somewhat wordy page.<BR/>http://www.gnome.org/community/<BR/><BR/>What about the just listing the different way to contribute. In big fat links!<BR/><BR/>"I want to translate"<BR/>"I can't code yet, help me learn"<BR/>And something similar about art/icons.<BR/><BR/>Maybe explaining basic requirements. But the links to a specific problem (art/code/translations) should help you get started EASILY! Otherwise we have a problem. <BR/><BR/>And yes, i'm not going to do anything about it, shoot me.Frejhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14243383028778701728noreply@blogger.com